Go over and have read of the challenge and of responses. Throw in your 2 cents.
I am still debating in my own head, but will put my response over there probably tonight. And I will update this post with it as well.
There are a few things I know I would change in the challenge, toss out the matches, put in my flint and steel, far superior to matches, especially when you are only alloted 1,000. Get rid of the sleeping bag, take my Wilde Blanket and ground cloth. Toss out the ax in favor of a small hatchet. More than adequate. In general, treat it like a great trek.
Since Kim doesn't want you to comment on anything other than the guns, I want to know what you would change in the other supplies. Don't add stuff, just replace or simplify.
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Update: Below is what I posted on the original post.
"I would have to go with a good lever action. Probably a 1894 Marlin in .44mag/special. Add a Ruger Blackhawk in .44mag.
This would allow for the only one type of ammo, sufficient for most of what would be encountered crossing the country. There is no need for something to take 300 yard shots. Use proper ammunition conservation and there should be no worry about having enough.
There is a whole lot of other stuff I would change but since we were requested not to post about it here, I linked to this from my own blog and asked a bunch of living history re-enactors for their opinions."
Also, why would anyone want to cross the country on a horse in 1650. There are no roads once you leave the coast. Lets be smart about this. Put together a group of 7-10 men, and a 32-36 foot canoe. The 1650 Interstate system is the rivers and lakes. Get rid of the toiletries, except the butt-wipe. I learned from my great-uncle who spent 5 months as a POW after the Battle of the Bulge, with no wipe. Gotta have the butt-wipe. I do like the idea of carrying a black powder gun or two. Probably a rifle, a fowler, and a pistol.
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5 comments:
1.No gold. Shell wampum, silver, and quill work.
2.Toiletries are extra baggage for a victim of fashion, not the frontier
3.Boots can stay, if they're light. both coats and the sleeping bag are replaced by good wool blanket.
4.No axe. Small belt hatchet, SMALL belt knife and neck knife, keep the gerber.
5.No matches, flint and steel. Flint is renewable
6.LAMINATED maps, binoculars, and small compass
7.keep small amount of cleaning supplies in a shooting bag, these too are renewable sources
8.No first aid "kit". Penicilin, tylenol, surgical and stitch kit. Don't forget the multi-purpose "sterilizer" for you and the wound.
Just my thoughts on the subject
Dragon Fly
Forget the gold. I think DF above had a good idea. I'd probably stick with silver since there is no way I'm going to get my hands on the other at a decent cost.
I'll take the backpack and a change of clothes, but I want leather needles and sinew as well. I don't need no stinking toiletries. Brush my teeth with campfire coal and I enjoy my heady scent.
I'd rather have an oilskin coat than a raincoat and a wool capote. But I do want the boots.
Sleeping bag, I think the capote and oilskin coat along with a nice heavy wool blanket would be enough.
The knives I wear at vous would be good enough for me. a decent belt knife and a neck knife. a decent camp axe. I'll take the multitool as well.
Flint and steel definitely.
Compass, spy glass and I like the idea of laminated maps.
My shooting pouch, stocked.
I want the disaster medical kit. Screw a first aid kit.
As for weapons. Sigh, this is tough. Modern I'd want my .357 taurus revolver and a Model 94 Winchester in the .357 caliber. Shared ammo and all.
Blackpowder. Laugh at me if you want, I'll take my Bess and the queen ann pistol Sure they are smooth bore, but dammit I can shoot anything out of them.
I agree with most of the kit but maybe something modern like a wind up flashlight. Those things rock. and definately the flint instead of matches.
As for a longgun I'll take my Saiga AK47. It's light, reliable, accurate, and can still take down a deer or whatever I'm after. Also, with a 40 round mag. It can also lay down the law if trouble happens. As an added bonus the rounds are heavy enough to hit hard yet 800 rounds is still fairly light.
As for a pistol, call me unorthodox and not romantic but I'll take the Uzi. (and yes it's a pistol http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/small_arms/uzi/Uzi-Pistol.html) It has a 32 round magazine, ability to use a silencer/barrel extender, and it's semi auto and scary looking in case of trouble. It's also made by Israel so it can take a beating and keep going. Anywho, that's my weapon reasoning.
I and at least one other person has pointed this out on Kim's board, but I'll say it again - horses can be and were extensively used throughout the Eastern woodlands, even in the absence of roads. Old growth forest didn't prove an obstacle to the early explrorers, longhunters, and Indians, who all relied on their horses for long trips.
Canoes sound great until you reflect on the fact that the French spent decades trying to find a viable water route to the West. In the end, the Northwest Passage proved as great a fable as El Dorado. Given that eventually you are going to need horses, and domesticated horses are going to be quite rare in 1650 oce past the White settlements, you would be better off starting with horses.
Like others have said, forget the gold and carry trade goods. Knives, needles, awls, perhaps a few light axe heads, and some beads would probably buy a village once near the Mississippi.
Provisions I can't do much with. I would want some soap, and a toothbrush and some paste would be handy. They don't weigh much, and the effort of carrying them would be amply repaid. I will feel a lot happier if I can clean myself from time to time, and I will be healthier in the long run.
Clothing would probably be just fine, so long as the boots were light and well made. Eventually, I'll probably end up in moccasins. I could switch out the coat or the raincoat for a matchcoat, but I'm not sure about that.
I like Kim's selection of blades just fine. I'd like to add a belt ax/tomahawk/hatchet, but I am not sure I want to switch out the full-sized ax for one.
I'll trade half the matches for a flint and steel.
Map, binoculars, and compass = good. Compass is the most important, I think followed by the map, but all would be enormously useful.
Can "toolbox" include a drawknife, brace, and bits? Those would be useful for building a semi-permanent shelter for the winter. That's why you don't want to ditch the ax, incidently. Stuck wintering in the Rockies with no ax to build a shelter...
First aid kit = good.
Firearms: Don't really know. What hunting I do would be big game. Hunting small game with a firearm isn't a very good strategy, because it uses up a lot more ammunition and gives off a large noise signature for the amount of meat. If I want small game, I'll use a snare. Therefore, the rifle is a big game/self-defence piece, and the pistol is an emergency/close range backup.
Modern weapons: I guess I'll stick with a bolt-action military rifle, as they are chambered for a heavy caliber and sturdy, unless a combination weapon like a drilling was available in a decent rifle caliber (say, 6.5 mm?). Pistol would be a .45 or similar. A Colt Peacemaker or similar revolver would do well, I think. I would trade out half the pistol ammo for rifle ammo, or shotgun shells in the case of the drilling.
Blackpowder weapons: If I am going with blackpowder I'll stick with a flintlock. I could take a swivel-breech double barreled rifle with one barrel rifled and the other smooth. Alternatively, I could trade the pistol for a take-down English fowler and carry a conventional rifle in .54 caliber - large enough to deal everything but a grizzly (which no blackpowder weapon is really a match for) but small enough that the ammo isn't too much of a weight if my horses die.
Ammo is interchangeable - powder and flints can be used in either weapon, and lead, whether in ball or bar configuration, can always be cast using the proper mold into what ever caliber is necessary.
If I had the option of adding things, I would add salt.
Grey Fox
Grey Fox,
Horses were very common throughout the Eastern frontier. However, I maintain that the rivers are a better way to travel. Starting on the East coast, pick any river, travel to the Ohio, the Ohio to the Mississippi, the Mississippi to the Missouri. Follow the Missouri like Lewis and Clark. It gets you closer to the West coast in an efficient manner, able to carry gear.
Maps and compass, based off today's map making techniques but with 1650 terrain.
I went for the .44 mag (along with some ammo loaded in .44 special since it is fairly big bore and will take down pretty much anything I would need. I agree, don't use the gun for small game-snares and traps.
For a black powder firearm-you could never get me to carry a percussion-you run out of caps you have a club. A flintlock is reliable and as long as you can find a rock you can shoot (provided powder is available, which would all have to be carried the whole distance).
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